Smart Gets Paid Podcast Transcript
Intro (00:02): You're listening to the Smart Gets Paid Podcast with me, Leah Neaderthal. I help women land higher paying clients in their B2B consulting and coaching businesses, but I've never been a sales person. My background is in corporate marketing. And when I started my first consulting business, I learned pretty quickly that it's about a thousand times harder to sell your own stuff than it is to sell someone else's. So I taught myself how to do it, and I created a sales approach that feels comfortable, makes you feel confident, and it works consistently. And now I teach women how to land higher paying clients in their B2B consulting and coaching businesses. So whether your client contracts are $2,000 or $200,000, if you want to work with more of the clients you love, do more of the work you love, and get paid more than you ever imagined. Then you're in the right place. Let's do it together. Welcome to Smart Gets Paid.
Leah (00:54): Hey, there, Leah here. And welcome to this episode of the Smart Gets Paid Podcast. So if you're in marketing, or communications, or digital marketing, or really anything marketing or communications related, we have an interesting problem when it comes to our own businesses. My background is in corporate marketing and what you find out pretty quickly when you start your own business, is that all the marketing and communications and all the good things we can do for our clients. It's so hard to do them for ourselves. We are the ultimate cobbler's kids. I work with a lot of women in all types of marketing and communications, and nearly everyone, to a person says something like “I can do this so easily for other people, but I can't do it for myself”. It was the same for me. It's funny. I was actually putting the finishing touches on a new program, called the Painkiller Workshop.
And I went back to screenshots of my very first website, when I started my consulting and coaching business. This is the business that became Smart Gets Paid and right there across the top of my website was my value statement. Helping small businesses grow, like what that is the worst line ever. It's not a painkiller at all. It's just like empty words. And I came from marketing. I should have known better. Thankfully, that line didn't last long before I reworked it. And that's how I developed the four painkiller principles that I share in the Painkiller Workshop. But I still totally cringe when I read that line, helping small businesses grow, but it's so hard, isn't it. When you come from anything marketing your communications and you have to turn the lens on yourself, the woman that I'm talking to in today's episode is struggling with the same thing.
(02:28): She's a consultant to nonprofits. And as you'll hear, she expresses the same frustrations that I hear from a lot of women in marketing and communications. You're going to hear us talk through it and come to some things that she can do. This conversation is a one-on-one coaching call with a student in my Pack Your Pipeline LinkedIn program. So I want to say a special thank you to her for allowing me to share this conversation with you. Take a listen. And at the end, I'll come back and share how you can apply a lesson from this call to your business.
Sponsor: Hey, before we dive in, I want to invite you to a free live training I’m leading on Tuesday, April 27th, called The One Sentence Pitch; how to instantly communicate your value so clients want to work with you. If you've been listening to this podcast, you've heard me talk about the painkiller, positioning your work as the must have solution to your client's number one problems. And that's what we're going to do in this free live training. You're going to learn how to clearly, concisely, communicate your value and stop feeling like you're kind of rambling. You're going to learn how to get the attention of the clients who value your work and who can actually afford you. And you're going to see the embarrassing way I pitched my work years ago before I figured out the system that I'm going to share with you and trust me, it's embarrassing. So join me on Tuesday, April 27th at 2:00 PM, Eastern 11:00 AM Pacific for a free live training on The One Sentence Pitch; how to instantly communicate your value so clients want to work with you. To register, go to smartgetspaid.com/pitchtraining, all one word. And that's pitch with a P and not well, you know. Smartgetspaid.com/pitchtraining. And if you happen to be listening to this after the date of the training, and you want to see if I'm doing another one soon, just go to smartgetspaid.com/future to see upcoming trainings and events. All right, on to the call.
Leah (04:14): So how do you feel about the system and you know, where do you have questions that we can talk through today?
Guest: So let's see, I guess, you know, I mentioned on some calls that I was working on my website, which I'm still continuing to do. I'm going to launch it right after labor day, which coincides with the one year anniversary of the launch of my business. So it feels like a nice time to say like, hey, new website, new blah, blah, blah. And at the same time, I'm going to also launch an email strategy, which I think for me might be sort of a blend of what you're recommending and sort of what I think works best for my niche.
Guest (05:02): So in terms of, you know, the lead magnet and then the followup sequence, having been where my clients are when I was inhouse, I think I need to go a little more gently. Maybe not as frequent emails. I don't know. Have you had experience like for people you've worked with that work more in the nonprofit sector, have you seen a difference there in terms of the strategy?
Leah: In frequency?
Guest: In frequency or tone or any really any observations? Or maybe there aren't any, but just curious.
Leah: Talk to me about what's happening here. What, you know, what do you think is driving your question?
Guest: Well, I'm nervous about sending too many emails.
Leah: Okay. Talk to me about that.
Guest: Well, cause I don't, I don't love getting tons of emails. I think a lot of people feel overwhelmed by email. I think there's a lot of competition for email. The amount of email I get, I don't read half of it. You know, I just don't read all of it. I guess what I'm wondering is if I send fewer, if they become a little bit rarer and therefore it's like, Oh, there's Emily's email. Like, I'm going to read it ‘cause I haven’t seen one in a couple of weeks.
Leah (05:58): So I understand the thinking, but first, you know, where you sort of apply your thinking to everybody else, right? Everyone has their own email habits, online habits, all of that stuff. And when you say that most of the emails you get, you delete that is sort of common. So conventional wisdom says that people open every third email. So if you send 1 email a month, then over the course of the year, they're only opening 4, they're only seeing 4 emails. If you're doing every other week and it goes up to 8. You know what I mean? Like if you send weekly it’s 16, but all that is to say, if you're only sending 1 email a month and they're only opening 4 a year, that's not enough touch points. That's not enough to build that know, like, and trust factor to stay top of mind. So the fact that, you know, you're worried that people won't open them. That's like a given. Right? And I don't mean to be cavalier about it, but it's like, okay. So knowing that, what do we do now? Right. And then in terms of the idea that if somebody doesn't get an email very often, that they're going to be very pleasantly surprised to get yours. That's I think an assumption that I don't know is based on people's actual habits.
Guest (07:07): Yeah.
Leah: It's more likely to get lost. Okay. I just wouldn't be so concerned about sending too many emails, pissing people off, anything like that. You know, if you're providing value, if you're educating, if you are not just blessing them with, hey, buy this or sign me up for this or, you know, whatever, then I wouldn't worry about it. You're providing incredible content. That's a service.
Leah (07:33): And so I don't know that there's anything unique about your space. In that, it's not like non-profit people are more sensitive or, you know, open more emails. I've not seen that, the women that I worked with who work with nonprofits, I've never heard anything like that.
Guest: Okay. That's helpful.
Leah (07:52): So I just think it's more, I want to sort of respect how you feel. I want to validate your concerns, but I just also want you to achieve your marketing and sort of client goals and staying top of mind is so important.
Yeah, no, I get that. And I guess the email part, you know, for the people who aren't on LinkedIn, or don't spend a lot of time on LinkedIn, it's a way to get the same or similar content to them that I'm posting daily. So it's really a lack of content, creating it anyway.
Leah (08:26): I know. Well, and that content that you're writing now provides a really great sort of starter log for blog posts. You can weave them together, tell them more complete stories in a longer newsletter. The benefit of what we're doing with the lead magnet is taking people from LinkedIn, the people who are seeing your stuff on LinkedIn to getting a newsletter is, you now own the relationship. Right? If they're in your system, you own how you communicate with them. And you're not subject to an algorithm or anything like that.
Guest (09:00): Right. But that's an excellent point. I like that, thinking about it as owning the relationship, that makes a lot of sense.
Leah (09:06): And so the way to sort of reconcile that with LinkedIn is it's okay for people to see some stuff on LinkedIn AND to get your newsletter. That's all right. That's actually what we want.
Guest (09:15): Right. Right. Okay. And I think the newsletter feels comfortable in terms of, you know, I like the idea of providing more content. The lead magnet is great for capturing emails. There's no question. I think sort of making the leap from what the lead magnet covers to what the client might need is a bigger gap because my clients range from people doing email fundraising to very customized, major gift proposals for one donor. So the writing needs in particular can really vary. And the staff who do that work really varies. So I think having a range of content in the newsletter is also really helpful because at some point someone will see themselves in it. You know, if not this week, next week.
Leah (09:59): Of course. Yeah.
Guest: That's good. That's good. Thank you.
Leah: Yeah, of course. What else, what else is sort of going on as it relates to getting clients, getting people in your orbit, how you're feeling about LinkedIn?
Guest (10:11): I'm pretty good about it. I guess I have to sort of work on the warmup conversation. You know, I mean a lot of people are connecting and most of the time people just accept the request and that's that. And then other times they'll send an email, a note back and say, thanks for reaching out. So, you know, that's sort of all we'll say. And so I'm trying to sort of get the right rhythm for how to then continue that conversation. And so I did actually have one person, I have a zoom call with her this week, who said, just sort of right off the bat, hey, do you want to chat? So that was exciting. Yeah, so that felt really good.
Leah (10:46): And what'd you do next?
Guest: I said, yes, let's set up a time. I would love to chat with you. And other people just say, hey, thanks for connecting. And it's those people that I'm trying to figure out. That's so ridiculous. Like, I'm 46 and I should be able to have a conversation with another professional person, but it feels like dating or this weird, awkward thing. Like, oh what do I write back?
Leah (11:12): Oh I know, Oh, there's so many dating analogies with BizDev on LinkedIn and just selling in general. And also, you know, I think we come from our, not our adult selves, but like our middle school selves.
Guest: Right, right. Like, is this person going to like me?
Leah: Exactly, exactly. So there are a couple of options, depending on how much attention you want to pay to it and where you want to spend your time. You can respond back and say, thanks for connecting. You know, I have this sort of standard message. Sometimes I send it out. Sometimes I don't, but it's just one thing where I don't ask for anything. Right. Like, I'm not saying let's get on a call or whatever, people aren't ready for that just yet. So you can do that for people who respond back. Thanks for connecting. You can do that to people who don't respond at all, or you can just sort of let it lie and let the content do the work.
Guest: Okay. That's what I've been doing with most of them. Unless they say something to me that is easy to respond to.
Guest: So that's not bad.
Leah (12:18): No. I mean, not at all. It's, it's really where you want to spend your time. What we're doing here is how to be seen as an expert using content, not using messages. Because it's so much more powerful to show people instead of tell people.
Guest (12:35): Definitely it is really amazing how hard it is though, to do this for yourself. I mean, this is the kind of stuff that I would advise clients, for example, who do email fundraising to send more, not less email, but somehow I can't apply that strategy to myself. It's very funny. There's like a whole psychology to that I imagine.
Leah (12:52): Oh, I'm sure. Yeah. I know exactly. You know, remember what you learned in Pack Your Pipeline. It's like, these are people just like you. And I think that the thing that, that sort of drives some of this is of course, you know, the way we've been socialized and want to be liked and all that stuff, but it's this idea of like, are they going to know? Are they going to know I'm trying to sell them something? Right? And the way you do that is like, don't sell them anything.
Guest (13:19): Yeah. Right. Just be useful.
Leah (13:21): Just be useful, just be helpful. And let the content do the work.
Guest (13:26): Writing that down, to let the content do the work. What else? I don't know. I'm feeling just generally very good about the whole thing. And I love getting up in the morning and like posting my home feed posts. And the other thing that I kind of love just as a little psychic reward is the graph on LinkedIn on a page where you can see who viewed your profile. It shows you your profile views, the little line graph, like mine is so much higher now. It's like the covid charts where suddenly there's a huge spike. Only this is good news.
Leah (13:58): Right. That's awesome. Anything else? I mean, this is your time.
Guest (14:05): I know. I feel like this call was really good. Cause you know, I did have a little bit of hesitation in some areas, so that's really helpful and no, I'm just feeling very good about the whole thing, so.
Leah (14:15): Good. Where was the hesitation? I'm just curious.
Guest (14:20): Oh, just in the worrying about too much email and how to do this sort of the thing you have in the lead magnet.
Leah (14:24): The nurture sequence?
Guest (14:26): The nurture sequence. Thank you. I'm having a sticking point there. And I think for me the idea of just an email newsletter, that's more like repurposing the LinkedIn content feels more like my speed.
Leah (14:41): In what ways do you think those are different?
Guest (14:44): That's a good question. Maybe it has to do with, I don't know. It's a combination of the tone and the content and the frequency that I just really worry about it coming off as too much. So I just need to figure out the right balance of those things.
Leah (14:52): Yeah. Well I think that can work really nicely together. So, when somebody requests your lead magnet, that is the warmest they will be at that moment. I mean, we're missed for the first interaction, right? Two weeks later there'll be colder. So at the moment where somebody says, listen, I have the problem that you are claiming to solve. And I am motivated to try to solve it. You know, they're saying, I need this information. I want it. And so all you're doing is sharing content that reinforces that, right? The thing that the problem they're trying to solve, that usually is talked about in a lead magnet and you're just offering it to them in a different way. Right? So email one says like, here's the thing that you offered, right? There you go. And then you're sharing more information in following emails and the emails could go out every day, every other day, you know, this is all stuff that helps them think about the problem differently. It's not just like spamming them right with, you wanted this lead magnet now by these 18 things.
Leah (16:02): All right. So one thing I want to quickly pull out of our conversation is just to call out that as women consultants and coaches, we give our best thinking to our clients and that's no surprise, really. You know, we have these incredible talents and we want to use them to help our clients get past their blocks and achieve their goals. It's just one of the reasons why I always say that it's about a thousand times harder to sell your own stuff than it is to sell someone else's. So if you're finding yourself stuck like this, ask yourself, what would it look like if you were your own client? So close your eyes, step back a few steps in your minds eye, and look at yourself as if you were a client. What would you tell that woman to do? Because that's what you probably should be doing yourself and just once give your best thinking to you.
Leah (16:52): Hey, thanks for hanging out with me. If you liked this episode, take a second and click the subscribe button wherever you're listening to your podcasts. And you'll be notified as soon as I release a new episode. And if you're listening on Apple podcasts and so appreciate it if you took two seconds and left a rating or review. This tells Apple podcasts, hey, there's good stuff in here and they'll recommend it to other listeners who might benefit from these lessons for their business. So please take a second and add a rating or review. Thanks. So that's it for now. I'll see you next time on the Smart Gets Paid Podcast.
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EP 9: When to talk price with your clients